Veda2.0 Released!


STORAGE MODELLING PROBLEM.
#1
   
Hello, I am trying to model some storages systems as the image shows, i am not showing the costs part since the problem comes with the input auxiliary which is electricity. The model is giving me problems and the results do not make much sense, but when i take put the ELC as an auxiliary input, and of course the information regarding INPUT which is 0.01, the results make more sense. 
Does anybody know why this form of modelling an storage would be incorrect?
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#2
> the problem comes with the input auxiliary which is electricity.

As there have been no responses, maybe I can try and help a bit, although I am not able to understand your modeling approach.

In order to model storage processes with auxiliary storage flows you should of course read the documentation, Chapter 4.3 Storage processes and Section 4.3.5 Auxiliary storage flows.  And there you can see that auxiliary storage flows are defined with the following parameters:

  ● PRC_ACTFLO(r,t,p,'AUX')    ! AUX proportional to activity
  ● FLO_FUNC(r,t,p,'STORED','AUX',s)  ! AUX proportional to input flow
  ● FLO_FUNC(r,t,p,'AUX','STORED',s)  ! AUX inversely proportional to output flow

When using VEDA2 for TIMES model management, you can find information for these attributes under the menu item TIMES and VEDA attributes, for specifying them under VEDA.

I can see in your picture that you are using the Input attribute for the ELC flows.  But Input is an alias for VDA_FLOP, which is not supported for storage processes.  In the old days, it was, in fact, stated as some kind of a workaround, because VEDA was unable to support FLO_FUNC, but later VEDA-FE and now VEDA2 have fully supported FLO_FUNC, and therefore Input/Output are no longer supported at all for storage (Input may or may not work for the workaround though).  So, please use the documented parameters for defining auxiliary storage flows.

Concerning other features of your storage processes, I am not able give much advice, because I am not quite able to understand your processes with all those power in / power out / energy variants, and I am not seeing essential information e.g. about PCGs, process types, commodity types, timeslice levels, and other RES connections. It would be interesting, though, to see in action all the advanced features you are modeling, and so if you can share your model it would be great.
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#3
(22-02-2024, 03:25 PM)Antti-L Wrote: > the problem comes with the input auxiliary which is electricity.

As there have been no responses, maybe I can try and help a bit, although I am not able to understand your modeling approach.

In order to model storage processes with auxiliary storage flows you should of course read the documentation, Chapter 4.3 Storage processes and Section 4.3.5 Auxiliary storage flows.  And there you can see that auxiliary storage flows are defined with the following parameters:

  ● PRC_ACTFLO(r,t,p,'AUX')    ! AUX proportional to activity
  ● FLO_FUNC(r,t,p,'STORED','AUX',s)  ! AUX proportional to input flow
  ● FLO_FUNC(r,t,p,'AUX','STORED',s)  ! AUX inversely proportional to output flow

When using VEDA2 for TIMES model management, you can find information for these attributes under the menu item TIMES and VEDA attributes, for specifying them under VEDA.

I can see in your picture that you are using the Input attribute for the ELC flows.  But Input is an alias for VDA_FLOP, which is not supported for storage processes.  In the old days, it was, in fact, stated as some kind of a workaround, because VEDA was unable to support FLO_FUNC, but later VEDA-FE and now VEDA2 have fully supported FLO_FUNC, and therefore Input/Output are no longer supported at all for storage (Input may or may not work for the workaround though).  So, please use the documented parameters for defining auxiliary storage flows.

Concerning other features of your storage processes, I am not able give much advice, because I am not quite able to understand your processes with all those power in / power out / energy variants, and I am not seeing essential information e.g. about PCGs, process types, commodity types, timeslice levels, and other RES connections. It would be interesting, though, to see in action all the advanced features you are modeling, and so if you can share your model it would be great.

Yes the main problem is with the INPUT attribute, because in the results is like the storage is using elc to produce the commodities that is supposed to store. I will look the documentation and see how those 3 attributes you have said are used. In the end my idea is just to say that the input and output process of the storage, needs some ELC to work out. That was all. 
Thank you
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#4
(22-02-2024, 03:25 PM)Antti-L Wrote: > the problem comes with the input auxiliary which is electricity.

As there have been no responses, maybe I can try and help a bit, although I am not able to understand your modeling approach.

In order to model storage processes with auxiliary storage flows you should of course read the documentation, Chapter 4.3 Storage processes and Section 4.3.5 Auxiliary storage flows.  And there you can see that auxiliary storage flows are defined with the following parameters:

  ● PRC_ACTFLO(r,t,p,'AUX')    ! AUX proportional to activity
  ● FLO_FUNC(r,t,p,'STORED','AUX',s)  ! AUX proportional to input flow
  ● FLO_FUNC(r,t,p,'AUX','STORED',s)  ! AUX inversely proportional to output flow

When using VEDA2 for TIMES model management, you can find information for these attributes under the menu item TIMES and VEDA attributes, for specifying them under VEDA.

I can see in your picture that you are using the Input attribute for the ELC flows.  But Input is an alias for VDA_FLOP, which is not supported for storage processes.  In the old days, it was, in fact, stated as some kind of a workaround, because VEDA was unable to support FLO_FUNC, but later VEDA-FE and now VEDA2 have fully supported FLO_FUNC, and therefore Input/Output are no longer supported at all for storage (Input may or may not work for the workaround though).  So, please use the documented parameters for defining auxiliary storage flows.

Concerning other features of your storage processes, I am not able give much advice, because I am not quite able to understand your processes with all those power in / power out / energy variants, and I am not seeing essential information e.g. about PCGs, process types, commodity types, timeslice levels, and other RES connections. It would be interesting, though, to see in action all the advanced features you are modeling, and so if you can share your model it would be great.
Also to mention that I am using Vedaonline, but i guess the problem is the same
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#5

.xlsx   SubRES_STO_Techs_noELC.xlsx (Size: 955.69 KB / Downloads: 2)
Hello again, here is my file where i am modelling some storages, as you can see here i am not using ELC as auxiliary input. When i run the hole model, there is one result that makes 0 sense. Which is this one:   
   

As you can see there is a negative flow in the OUTPUT of the KRE storage. Can anyone maybe have a look at it, and maybe see why this could be happening? Thank you so much
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