Unnormal results

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Such a warning is given when you define NCAP_START(r,p) = year (meaning that process p becomes available in that year), but you nonetheless have some existing capacities defined.  In such a case, the delay of the process is ignored for the existing capacity, which is thus assumed available despite NCAP_START. The GDX file shows that you had defined NCAP_START=2035 for these processes, and therefore the warning.

Hi Antti,

Clear now! Thank you!

After cross-comparing the results of higher (Current measures scenario) and lower carbon emissions scenario (CNZ, which means net-zero in 2050), I found it's weird that the cost (Cost_inv or Cost_Flow)/the activity level for importing oil from other country would be greater for lower CO2 scenario [IMPOILDST process]. Which drive me wondering if it is reasonable.

Besides, the investment on the clean geo-energy for net-zero scenario is extremely greater (e.g., MINRENGEO1, ELCGEO00, EUGEOF01) while that for solar, wind, hydropower is nearly same for both carbon scenarios (MINRENHYD1, MINRENSOL1). But I have checked the attributes and found that they have only been set the IRE_PRICE but without ACT_BOUND or NCAP_BOUND, should I put some limit on it for a more reasonable result?

Third but most important, the CO2 emissions for sectors like transport, agriculture are unnormal same for the lower and higher CO2 scenario, and the only difference lies in the carbon capture tech investments. Which because that the trajectory (like the sector demand, stock) are same? I am totally confused.

However, the mining, refinery activity level would be lower for net-zero scenario, which is normal for lower-emission scenario.


Best,
Xiao

[AKanudia]

Ok, maybe VO does not give you access to the *.VD file, but the GDX file is at least provided (I just checked on VO, and yes, it is provided).  The VD file can be produced from the full GDX file.  So, can you provide the full GDX file instead?  A download link for it would be fine, if it is too big to attach here.

Storing VD files was made optional in Veda2.0 in Sep 2022. Veda online uses this feature. The package downloaded from VO can be imported directly into Veda2.0.

[frangb99]

If you have defined investment costs for vintage v, then there are investment costs reported for vintage v in period t, whenever there is capacity of vintage v in period t. Therefore, I think you must have some capacity of vintage v in period t in your results.  That capacity does not have to be new (VAR_NCAP), it can be old capacity as well (endogenous or exogenous). So, it is perfectly normal to have investment costs reported for vintage v in period t, even if you have no VAR_NCAP in period t.

One question, in Veda online i have the LUMPINV values, and i understand is just the multiplication of NCAP_COST*VAR_NCAP. But in my case when i do the multiplication by hand the numbers i have are slightly different than the ones that VEDA is giving me. I mean for example for ELCRNWIN01, when i do the multiplication by hand i got 12322, and VEDA is giving me 12490 as you can see in the image. Is this because discount rate is being taken into consideration? or there is something else' thank you so much

[Antti-L]

What you quoted was my explanation about the Cost_Inv results.  They are annualized undiscounted investment costs.

Converning the LUMPINV values, I did explain earlier in this thread that they are not just the multiplication of NCAP_COST×VAR_NCAP.  They represent the lump-sum investment cost equivalent to the total value of the investment costs at the beginning of the commissioning year. So, yes, it effectively means discounting all the annual investment payments (see the documentation) to the beginning of the commissioning year. Optionally, the impact of the hurdle rate can also be separated in the LUMPINV reporting.

> when i do the multiplication by hand i got 12322, and VEDA is giving me 12490 as you can see in the image.

There was no image, was there?  For explaining your value, all the parameters related to the investment cost calculation would be needed (NCAP_COST, NCAP_DRATE, G_DRATE, NCAP_ILED, NCAP_TLIFE, NCAP_ELIFE, B(T), E(T)), as well as the vintage period T in question...

[Antti-L]

Storing VD files was made optional in Veda2.0 in Sep 2022. Veda online uses this feature.

So, you mean VO does also have this option to "store" VD files? I mean stored as files on disk, not stored in the database. Can you help pointing out where that tick checkbox is; I tried to look for it but could not spot that option there. 

[AKanudia]

No Antti, VO doesn't have the option to store VD files. But do you feel the need for this?

[Antti-L]

Not really, just wanted to be sure that I understood you correctly that VO does have this option (to store VD files), and to have a better understanding of the VO options and where they can be set. I can always generate the VD file locally from GDX files.

So, my apologies, as I did not understand your correctly, and thanks for clarifying me (once again).

[AKanudia]

Xiao, I think you are expecting sensible results from the model before completing the set up and running some basic checks on it. See the views I have created in Results. Most of the electricity is being produced by EUGEOF01 and consumed by S_CCUS_ATM_LowAF. Both these have no investment cost specified - they only have the default values that I had added for investment cost reporting to show up. Not the biggest issue, but you have not projected the demands either.

To start with, you have to make sure that energy flows in key sectors are reasonable in a "Reference" scenario (one without any major policy targets or measures).

[AKanudia]

Antti and other users, you can access the model quite easily now - just go to Veda online (https://vedaonline.cloud/) and type CAN_TIMES in the search box on top. You don't even need to log in. You will see model CAN_TIMES_v1 in the list. Click, and you will be able to see Browse, Items View, Results etc.

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Antti and other users, you can access the model quite easily now - just go to Veda online (https://vedaonline.cloud/) and type CAN_TIMES in the search box on top. You don't even need to log in. You will see model CAN_TIMES_v1 in the list. Click, and you will be able to see Browse, Items View, Results etc.

Hi Dr. Amit,

I have supplemented the demand for agriculture and transportation sector (because other sector had been quantified before). And the investment was supplemented too. The VAR_FOUT of NRG from IRE processes, CO2 emission, Electricity production and consumption seems more normal. However, in different CO2 constraint scenarios, the final energy for transportation and commodity sector are same, is that given rise by the unbalance energy flows of base scenario?

Best,
Xiao

[[email protected]]

No Antti, VO doesn't have the option to store VD files. But do you feel the need for this?

Hi Antti,

It is indicated from DEMO models that the base-scenario tech has no NCAP_COST (with their NCAP_BND as 2). Yet I am wondering how they invest on these techs after the end of their life? (because their life is shorter than the simulation period length).

With CAPEELC tech in DEMO9 as an example, it's TLIFE is 5-year which cannot exist to 2050.

Best,
Xiao

[AKanudia]

Do you mean that you see capacity or new investment in CAPEELC in 2050 in Demo9 - without any modifications?

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Do you mean that you see capacity or new investment in CAPEELC in 2050 in Demo9 - without any modifications?

No, but mine has new-capacity in 2050 for BASE techs. Should I delete the introduced NCAP_COST table and only complemented the NCAP_COST to new-techs?

Best,
Xiao

[AKanudia]

Which model are you talking about?

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Which model are you talking about?

Thank you! Have figured it out! Would you like to check the model results again?

Best,
Xiao